Is this a good deal??

Ok I'm somewhat close to a deal on my new FZ1 but I still think I can do a little better but please give me your thoughts....

$8599.00 Discounted Price (2009 FZ1 with graves pipe)
$419.00 Freight (is this normal to charge this??)
$325.00 Set Up (should I pay these fees??)
$199.00 Dealer Service Fee (too many fees)
$3.50 Florida State Tire and Battery
-$5200.00 Trade (for 2009 FZ6R)
$304.19 Tax
$130.00 Tag
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$6300.00 Payoff (negative equity of $1200)
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$11,079.69 OTD

I offered $10,250 OTD without the fees but he said he could not go any lower b/c they had no more rebates what do you think. Your help is greatly appreciated. Thanks.
 
We too paid $7800 out the door for 09 leftover from Razee (tax paid in MA)

I have an issue with all the set up and dealer fees .. and unless they are shipping you the bike frieght too !
 
Thanks Eric. I had hoped you would reply. Your input is always welcome Thank you my friend. I am trying to get out of the FZ6R (need a bigger bike) but don't want to get taken so I am looking currently. Selling outright right now is a complete waste of time. Nobody wants to give any $$ and nobody has any anyways. So I was looking at a trade.
 
You're welcome. Also, please read through this article: Motorcycle Buying - How To Buy A Motorcycle From A Dealer

Call other dealers and inquire about the same fees to gauge the difference between them. When I bought my '08 FZ6, I emailed/called over 15 dealers in New England and New York and pitted them all against one another. Many were touting "Best service Dept" etc. I told them all, that service isn't on the table. I do all my own work and I'm looking for the rock bottom OTD price. One will come though for you. :D
 
I feel the price for the 09 leftover FZ1 is too high with the fees as well, but the trade offer for your FZ6 is EXTREMELY inflated, so it balances out.

If you were looking for a 2009 FZ1 without the trade, I'd say you'll do much better elsewhere, but they inflated the price of your trade by in my opinion at least $2,000.

I'd say they are asking $1,400 too much for their FZ1, but the inflated trade number is making it up.

If you have to get rid of the FZ6 in order to get the FZ1, it's not a horrible deal, considering your negative equity in the FZ6.

If it were me, I'd keep the FZ6, but no-one will give you $3,800 for it when dealers are giving them away near me (Pennsylvania) for $5,200 cash new. Basically, the dealer is willing to get you out of your bike to do this deal.

Realize of course, if you do it, you'll have an $11,000 loan on a bike that's carrying a used value of $6,000 max.

Having worked both sides of the desk both as a buyer and a dealer, my thoughts would be that if you NEED to ride what you want to ride and it will make that big a difference to you, the "deal" isn't bad. Just the DEAL. The thought of an $11K debt on an 09 FZ1 would make me pass.

Hope it works out for you either way, and keep us posted on your thoughts.
 
Another thought I just wanted to add...

Tell them to keep their pipe and give it to you for the $10,250.

They are hitting you for full retail on a pipe and installation that you can get for far less anywhere else.

They won't want to do it, but you might get them to pull it off and reduce the cost of the new bike.

I'd still pass, but I'm just trying to arm you with all the tools you can have.

Good luck!
 
If you want the bike, tell him to cut freight, set-up and dealer fees in half and you'll take it. They don't need factory rebates to cut those costs.
 
Really?

I personally think your trade in is not to far off depending on mileage and condition.


Hail, I'm not one to instigate, and I have no problem with differing opinions, and you and I have agreed on most every issue, but after reading this post I have to say...

How do you figure?
 
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Hey Wenmark,

I wanted to chime in because my situation was very close to this. I'm sure you don't remember me, but I was sort of active awhile back on the FZ6R forums under another username (nc_fz6r I think). Silly me keeps putting model names into my username which makes it obsolete with new bikes!

Anyhoo, I went into my local dealership here near Raleigh, and because it's the same dealership where I bought the FZ6r, they also offered me what I considered a great trade-in amount ($5100). On the floor, they had 1 last 2009 holdover, a beautiful blue cobalt blue with 0.1 miles on it. Completely stock, however.

So knowing that I already had $5100 to work with, and a couple back-and-forths with the sales manager, we finally agreed on $3600 OTD. I had no lien on the FZ6r, and I paid this difference in cash. So in total, I paid $8700 OTD. Was it an absolute steal like is advertised by some these days? No.... but since I had a trade-in to deal with I think I did pretty good.

Of course the big difference between our two deals, is the existing lien and your new loan. I know dealerships hate dealing with them, but heck, in this economy they should be happy to be swallowing the extra hassle. I'm in agreement with the others in that they should drop their amount by 1k.

I hope it works out for you, cause I know you're absolutely going to love the FZ1. It's a bike with so much potential that you won't be looking ahead at what else is out there for a long time. (At least that's the line I told my wife!!) :Rockon:
 
Hail, I'm not one to instigate, and I have no problem with differing opinions, and you and I have agreed on most every issue, but after reading this post I have to say...

How do you figure?

Because the '09 FZ6R average retail is $4900 and average trade is $3700 thus $5200 is a GOOD trade-in value. I keep up with this particular bike because my wife owns the very same one. ;)
 
Eric, I think you're misreading Hail's post and agreeing with me. If wholesale is $3,700 and average retail is $4,900, a $5,200 trade value is EXCELLENT, not just good, and obviously far inflated over the actual trade value of the 2009 FZ6R.

Unless I misread Hail's comment, he's suggesting that a 2009 FZ6R ACTUALLY HAS a trade-in value close to $5,200, which you're pointing out with me is over average RETAIL.

If you look at the difference between the actual trade-in value of that bike being close to $3,500 (How else will the dealer make money on selling it if they buy it for more than retail?) and the offered trade in amount of $5,200, it clearly makes sense that he's offsetting the costs of his FZ1 by inflating the FZ6R radically beyond it's trade in value.

Now, for the good part... Do you know why they would do this instead of lower the number on the FZ1 and FZ6R to show actual values and charge the same difference?

You CANNOT by LAW finance negative equity in someone's car, bike, boat, etc... Thus, you have to show the HUGE trade-in value on a bike that's being brought in with negative equity and still finance the new bike for almost full price in order to secure the financing through HSBC or any other bank/credit union.

Back-end money on the loan is where this deal is going for the dealer, with instant cash immediately paid as a percentage on the total NEW amount financed. In order to make any of that, they have to get him out of his bike without showing a trade-in of $3,800 or close to it or they could not justify the difference in his existing loan.

Yes, dealers do it all the time, and that's done all the time in order to make a deal. That's how the business is run, regardless of the laws which govern it. That is the way around his negative equity. The banks will have a maximum loan amount available for that bike, and he's going to finance every penny of it.

I will stand by this without retraction since I have so much professional knowledge of the business. All I'm trying to do is help out the guy looking for a deal.

Hopefully, you and I are reading it the same way and seeing it identically as a $5,200 wholesale value as being unbelievably inflated, not as was described as "accurate depending on mileage and condition". If it has 1 mile and has never left the showroom but been titled, it's not worth $5,200 to a retail buyer when there's new ones for $5,200-5,800 with no fees that can be financed with promotional new bike rates. Why would a wholesale buyer pay that? See above.
 
Blavenia, see if you can explain this;

Earlier this year (march to be exact), I traded in a fully stock '08 concours 1400abs with over 35K miles on it on a new '09 fz1. The deal was my old bike plus $3200. The paperwork said they gave me $6500 for the c14. Which means the fz1 supposedly cost $9700. Realistically, I figure they gave me more like $5500 to 6K for the trade, which made the OTD price seem even better.

Now, is a 2.5 yr old c14 with 30K+ miles on it worth 6K? I'd say so. Considering new 09's could be have for 10-11, and 2010's for a bit more. Also taken into consideration was the fact that the bike needed everything... Tires, coolant, valve adjustment, spark plugs, front and rear suspension renew, and probably some other things.

At that time of the year, I felt that was a reasonable offer for several reasons. A), I priced around to see what fz1's were going for from a number of dealers. B) I didn't have time for a fly'n'buy, but also, I had the c14 to get rid of.

Here's the kicker. The bike's been sitting in the showroom since march 2010, and to this date has still not sold. They did drop the price by a gran to 9K, but doubt it'll sell until they drop it to 7 or 8K.

So the question is, did the dealer really profit much on this deal?
 
Brian, I did read it as you did, but it was the open-ended question you posted that was most puzzling, hence the answer. End result is yes, we are thinking the same way regarding the deal. ;)

I do know all about the deals and how negative equity plays in. I've been in that situation too many times in the past with foolish decisions. Sometimes it is a necessary evil. My wife and I are trying to rectify this for the first time and never be faced with a negative equity again. I'm keeping the Tacoma and paying it off. She got her car @ 0% and will pay that off. Her bike was bought with cash and a clear title. Mine is payments and about break even but I have no intentions of selling or trading the FZ1.

The end result will be this (take note, those of you bitten with the negative equity!): We will not have a bike payment or any auto payments after 4 years. At that time, all monthly payments will STILL come out of our checks but instead go into a separate savings account. When a vehicle needs to be replaced (or repaired), we will pull it from that money. We hope to have enough in there so that when the car or truck needs to be replaced, it is a cash deal. The nest will keep building and then the other vehicle will be replaced.

And when dealing with a sales person, without a loan/trade/financing and talking a cash-only deal, you can score a sweet package because you're 100% in the driver's seat and there's enough competition to play one off another. :tup:
 
I'd say hold onto the FZ6R and wait till spring if the bike is still there it'll be discounted really deep and you'll have more of your fz6 payed off and will end up coming out better in the deal IMHO
 
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