Damn surging continues... Continued!

FZ1inTX

FZ1inTX

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Unsure if any of you are following the thread over at the FZ1OA site... But I started having this problem with mine... a 2009 with 600 miles on her now.

Things completed:

Two Bros slip-on (CAT still intact)
EXUP eliminated (See above)
AIS blockoff - Nothing removed, jusy blocked the tube and clamped back to the airbox
LARS airbox mod
De-screened stock air filter

Here's what I've not done anything with to date:

I don't have a PC III (or V), just the stock ECU.
As stated, still have the CAT.
AIS valve and tubes still in place just no more fresh air.
Flies have not been modified or tied.

The issue is when I am just cruising in traffic at a steady 3 - 5K RPM range, the bike will momentarily cut, sputter and surge. These are very slight. If I roll the throttle, the bike works perfectly. If I get below 3k RPMs (very slow in high gear), the bike doesn't "seem" to do anything wrong.

In the other forum, the suggestions were as follows:
1. Wrong map (Nope, I have the stock ECU)
2. O2 Sensor eliminator (Again, stock ECU and O2 Sensor still in use)
3. Fuel or vent lines kinked (I believe this would PREVENT me from rolling on the throttle and having excellent acceleration, correct?) I did check the tubes and was careful about this having come from the FZ6 which is also prone to hose issues after lifting the tank.
4. Electrical connections - loose, dirty, wet, etc. I've not checked and will as soon as I secure a hefty supply of dielectric grease, then I'll go through them all and seal them up.
5. Bad fuel - Again, she accelerates fine and I've tried three different stations, one gets theirs from Sprague, one from Irving and the last from Global so I know it is three different tank farms!
6. Fuel filter in pump clogging - Once more, accelerates fine
7. Dirty injectors - Yup, still accelerates fine!

:surrender: Any thoughts? Ideas? the only two major changes was the TBR can which removed the EXUP and the AIS blockoff. I find it difficult to believe that the LARS and screen removal, letting the bike breathe better, causes this. I did this on the FZ6.

Please start throwing out comments, suggestions etc... I'm about to return the bike to stock to see if the problem stays or goes.

Tonight, I've disconnected the battery and will reconnect it tomorrow. I know it's only 30 seconds to clear the ECU but I just don't feel like going back outside to the garage (raining.... AGAIN!) ;)

Tomorrow, I'll be going to the store to get the grease among other items... I'll work on the connections Thursday.

She's a great bike but this is starting to annoy me on a brand new bike. It appears in the other forum that is is all GEN II bikes with a vast array of mods and even a couple very close to stock. This isn't a show stopper but I'm having doubts about modding this beast at this point.
 
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I'd bet that you are experiencing a "lean surge" which almost always occurs in a constant throttle condition. When you give it a little gas, the extra fuel richens the situation. If yo can cough-up the additional $300 or so, I'm sure a PCIII will take care of it and allow you to modify your fueling at will. A PC V vs the III may be a good choice also because it uses the O2 sensor to modify the fuel mixture as you drive the thing but it's also more coin. I put a aftermarket O2 sensor and guage on my bike so I can see what's happening to the mixture. If you could get to a high elevation area, you might see a slight improvement if in fact your are a bit on the lean side.
 
Ditto on the lean surge... it's hard to diagnose, as it occurs under steady throttle at a certain RPM... it's not like you can pull the plugs and say... Oh.. that's my problem! I'm lean at 3-5k rpm... ... at higher RPM, you may be running rich, and the plugs may reflect a "normal" reading due to lean at bottom, rich at top scenario.....

Modding the air-box and filter allowed for more air to get into the system, which will really be apparent at lower RPM... you have to adjust for all of this new-found air, and unfortunately, the only way to do so is with a PC-3 or PC-V ....

I think you can test our theory by pulling the airbox, and covering the modified part (hole) with a sheet of cardboard and duct-tape.... if it goes back to running normal with less air flow, that's definitely what your problem is.... I'm willing to bet that's what it is anyhow, but the cardboard would prove it.... before buying a PC-3/PC-V.
 
My bike is doing something similar ever since I installed the R-77 exhaust. It seems most noticeable in the 3k RPM region while cruising in town at small throttle openings.

As the others have stated it's probably a lean condition. I have the PC V on my bike, but I just threw on of the supplied DynoJet maps that matched my mods the closest. I will play with some different maps this Sunday if I get a chance.

And by the way once I get to the higher RPMs there is no issue whatsoever :D
 
I'd do what VA Rider was saying. I've found on a couple of my in-line fours of the past that trying to re-work the intake is far more complex than the exhaust. If you want to read an excellent article on air boxes, pick up the July issue of Cycle World and read Kevin Cameron's article on the complexity of air boxes and how the exact shape and volume is determined. There aren't many riders who have the tools to measure the results of small changes to an engines modifications like the original engineers who build these things
 
Aaron, thanks for the suggestion about the cardboard. I actually kept the piece I cut out since it came out in one piece so I may try s duct tape job to put it back on for a trial and see if that is the issue.

I do intend to buy the PC in one version or another (likely the V) and get a map close to what I am running then start tweaking it. But, that is something I'll have to works toward because money is tied up with remodeling until the house is done. Trading in two bikes for two new ones is making modding difficult. ;)

I'll start there and see if that is the easy fix until I can get the PC V. :D
 
Well, I finally got a good ride in after the ECU reset. This seems to have solved about 80% of the issue. I think the rest means I really need the PC V so I can tune the beast for proper fuel. It ran smoothly most of the day and only sputtered once in a while. Mostly, a steady pace though. ;) I did 257 miles today. Oh and I got 39.5 mpg on the full tank that started the ride. :D It was a medium paced tour, nothing drastic as there was a lot of traffic everywhere.
 
You just wait....there was a man who made a similar statement. In fact commented on how in few years time, he still be riding the stocker....

What are you up to Lonerider59 ---

slip-on/pcIII/O2 sensor/painted screen (and that is just what he has been public about)

Your time will come.....mark my words. It will just be a matter of how hard you are bitten by the infectious mod bug....
 
My advice is to fit one of these. Should sort out or your problems! It adds quite a bit of weight and doesn't sound so good though! :)

You can pick them up really cheaply on Ebay. In fact I've got one you can have at a real steal.......

Just playin' with ya! Hope you get a simple solution!

Cheers

Simon
 
:p Nice! ;)

There is a simple solution, it is just expensive! It's a PC V. :D

Trust me, this isn't a show stopper. It's just a little annoyance for me because I like the bike running perfect. Actually, it's shame on me for NOT getting the PC V first and then doing all these mods.

It's such a small deal that I rode 339 miles today. :thewave:
 
FZ1inNH said:
:p Nice! ;)

There is a simple solution, it is just expensive! It's a PC V. :D

Trust me, this isn't a show stopper. It's just a little annoyance for me because I like the bike running perfect. Actually, it's shame on me for NOT getting the PC V first and then doing all these mods.

It's such a small deal that I rode 339 miles today. :thewave:
Click to expand...

Well even with the PC V there are still spots here and there that my bike doesn't run great. Mostly steady cruising with small throttle opening. I have tried a few of the maps out there and still an issue at some RPM. I don't have time to sit around tinkering with the maps all day so the only solutions are custom tune or Auto Tune. Guess which one I'm going for...Auto Tune will be ordered next week. Another member found it online for $199, which is the best price that I have seen out there. This is probably half of what a good tune is going to run. Will it be comparable? Who knows, but I am guessing that it will be close enough and will compensate for any future mods too. I was able to get my PC V for $257 shipped and haven't seen it any cheaper
 
Dielectric Grease did the trick for me

I have an '06 FZ1 with an FCE installed. It worked great for 1000 miles or so, but all of the sudden was a bucking bronco that left me temporarily stranded on the side of the highway.
I disconnected my EXUP motor but that didn't help. After reconnecting it, I applied dielectric grease to all FCE and ECU connections. So far, so good. Let's hope it stays that way.
 
Hey there my old friend, Im still around and as you know, back on my 08 FZ. The Triumph was re-traded a couple days after we got back from TX this spring. Bike is running lke a top. I don't think it went even for a singe spin the 11 months it sat at the dealership. She's still got the MIVV Suono and PCIII and that's about it. Just waiting for the weather to warm up here. This morning it was 31.5. Too damned cold to ride but I expect to ride Monday morn ing for our veteran's memorial in Traverse City.
 
Great timing bringing this thread back up.

My 09 started surging in full stock trim with just a few miles on it. Now with the mods listed in my sig, I still have this surging, but only in 4rth gear and at pretty much any RPM, but only when I'm trying to stay at a steady cruise, or slightly accelerating. Full acceleration and full deceleration doesn't show any signs of surging, all other gears run smooth and seamless.

Any ideas on what this "4th gear dependent" surging might be?
 
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