Gen 1 Starting and Stalling issues

Klurejr

Klurejr

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This issue came up on Monday. I have about 66,500 miles on the motor now. She started up just fine (did my injector treatment a few weeks ago) rode to work no issue, let the bike sit for most of the day, about 7-8 hours. Went to start her up and it just turned and turned. made a few small pops, blew some fire. still took a few more turns of the starter and finally came to life. Ran just fine all the way home, no sputter, no issues. I thought it was a fluke.

Drove my car yesterday because of the rain.

This morning, Started up with no issues cold (on choke), took her off choke and rode over to the Gas Station to fill up. After sitting off for the few min it took, she would not fire back up. It was so bad I pushed her out of the way and tried again multiple times over the course of a few mins. Just nothing, no pops, no backfire, nothing. Almost as if there was no spark or no fuel. I called my wife to bring the truck and ramp. I waited about 5-7 min and tried it again, just for giggles and it fired right up, just as my wife was pulling into the station. Was idling just fine. I rode it home and shut it off, then fired it right back up, no issues. Turned it off and let it sit for 20 seconds and then tried to fire back up and nothing....

So I took my other bike to work today.


This is the first time I have ever had an issue trying to start it when warm.

Thoughts?
 
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theWolfTamer said:
Battery? Bad or going Battery Makes it do weird things.
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hmm, did not think about the battery being bad or going bad. Could it not be providing spark? I have been running the same battery since I bought the bike a few years ago, would not hurt to replace it anyway. I will try that and get back to you guys. Thanks.
 
Klurejr said:
hmm, did not think about the battery being bad or going bad. Could it not be providing spark? I have been running the same battery since I bought the bike a few years ago, would not hurt to replace it anyway. I will try that and get back to you guys. Thanks.
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I doubt it's the battery, first signs of a weak battery is weak starter. With electronic ignition, the ignition will still work when the battery is too weak for the starter.

Maybe your carbs should be checked by a pro?
On my bike (2003), the choke is not only useless, but the bike won't start or run with any setting of the choke except fully off.
I anticipate that it will have to be checked at the shop by the time the weather gets cold (Florida here, so it will be a while...) I will probably have Ivan's jet kit installed then.
Starting the bike always takes two short cranks of the starter, with a little bit of gas the second time. If for whatever reason it does not start the second time, then a 3rd time with no gas does it.

Good luck and let us know what you find.



sent from my Moto-X on Tapatalk
 
I was on vacation for a week so I had no progress to report yet. I still think I should change the battery, just because it is old and I have seen dying batteries do some really wonky things in cars before when they start to go.

If the carbs were dirty and needed to be cleaned I would think I would have cold start issues still, which I do not. Choke works just fine when cold.
 
Dustin said:
Do you have a volt meter? I would be curious what voltage the battery is at after it's been sitting overnight
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I do not have one.

Again the issue is not cold starts anymore, but Hot Starts....

This morning she fired up right away(after sitting for over a week while on vacation) with choke on and rode just fine all 34 miles down to the office. I will be leaving here soon and will see what I got, while not a "hot" start since I Have been at work for 8 hours now.... I am not sure what I will get.

I plan to ride it all week. i will update as I gather more info.
 
Update from yesterday:

After work (bike sat for 7-8 hours) she fired right up with the Choke.

Made a few stops on the way home:

Stop 1 - stayed for 30-40 min. Came out to a warm engine, fired up first try no Choke.

Stop 2 - Stayed for 15-20 min. Came out to a warm engine, fired up first try no Choke.

Stop 3 - Stayed for 15 min. Came out to a warm engine, fired up first try no Choke.



So, perhaps it was a fluke that I had a warm start issue??? I plan to ride the bike all week and see what happens. Thanks for all the suggestions.
 
This AM She gave two back fires before she started up under choke. Stalled twice while warming up, but re-started with no issues each time.

made one stop for about 10 min this morning and fired up with no issues when warm.

(Mostly documenting this for my own records)


Once warmed up and going runs great, no issues.
 
Edited the Original Post because I think it was confusing. Cold Starts are not an issue.


Notes from this morning:

Fired up fine cold. Rode 40 miles to meet a friend for an early breakfast. Sat for about 70-75 min. Uppers 60's outside as the sun was coming up. Went to start and she cranked with no response about 3 or 4 times. Tried the Choke (even though the block was still warm) with same result. Turned key off and let sit for 60 seconds while I put my helmet and gloves on. Turn on ignition, turned on Choke, small backfire and then she started right up, turned of choke immediately. Stalled once I got going, but bumped started back up. No more issues the next 10 miles or so.


With the backfiring, could that be me flooding the engine?
 
Dustin said:
I'm wondering if you have some issue with the carbs, a stuck float perhaps? Have you noticed your fuel economy drop off at all?
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I got 40mpg on my last tank, I have averaged 40-44 for the life of the bike. So I guess 40mpg is on the lower end of the norm. I filled up with 91 instead of 87 this morning to see if running a tank of slightly better gas through it will help anything out.

I forgot to include in my log for today, I left the house and went to get some gas first thing, and she started up immediately after I filled up. No issues there.
 
Updates:

Tuesday; Started fine. Ran fine to first stop. Sat for 2 hours. Started back up no issues. Ran fine to next stop. Sat for 1.5 hours. Started fine, ran great entire way home.

Today (Wednesday): Started fine cold. Sat for 1 hour at first stop. Started back up no issues. Went to gas station 20 min later. Had issues started after a fill up. Took about 3-5 min before she would fire back up. Ran fine to the office (where I am now).
 
It's either fuel or spark...

Check the coils and test them for proper output/resistance. Check the floats to be sure none have junk in them that would keep the needles from seating and that none have sunk/saturated. Throw in a new set of plugs but inspect the old ones to see if one or more cylinders are showing any odd signs like a blackened or wet plug. Last, check the fuel pump... is it outputting the correct fuel pressure? Might be a worn/bad/loose electrical connection to the pump that is causing it to stop pumping fuel?
 
FZ1inNH said:
It's either fuel or spark...

Check the coils and test them for proper output/resistance. Check the floats to be sure none have junk in them that would keep the needles from seating and that none have sunk/saturated. Throw in a new set of plugs but inspect the old ones to see if one or more cylinders are showing any odd signs like a blackened or wet plug.
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The plugs are only about 5000 miles old, I am leaning more towards a coil or float issue. I am scared to death of taking apart the Carbs seems like a big job to me.
 
Klurejr said:
The plugs are only about 5000 miles old, I am leaning more towards a coil or float issue. I am scared to death of taking apart the Carbs seems like a big job to me.
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It can be daunting if you your having doubts about it, I'd take it to a trusted mechanic. :D Getting them in sync is the hardest part. The rest is cleaning and rinsing with carb cleaner. ;)
 
I wonder if you are getting a vapour lock in the tank. I've had an issue somewhat similar to this before, albeit on a 1981 bike. It ended up being vapour lock and I cleared out the vent hoses and greased the gas cap seal and all was well.
 
Dustin said:
I wonder if you are getting a vapour lock in the tank. I've had an issue somewhat similar to this before, albeit on a 1981 bike. It ended up being vapour lock and I cleared out the vent hoses and greased the gas cap seal and all was well.
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hmmm. Could that be why it seems to only be an issue after I fill up with gas when the motor is warm? Because the two times it has really given me fits is directly after a fill up.
 
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